Invisapeeps 2.0

Balloon Animal · Guru

RE: Rant No birthday present?

ana · Senior Member

I don't define being a good daughter by buying birthday cards or phone calls.

Cactus · Senior Member

Balloon Animal wrote:
OpheliaDev1 wrote:
"But he is not one of those grandparents I see with their friends who come to every award program at school or every dance recital (he has missed 2 of Hip Hop's so far) or every birthday party (he missed one because he was mad at me and got pissy and did not show up even though he knew he was wanted there), field trip, class party, etc."

Well, I will say that I actually find it weird when you see grandparents at stuff like that. Grandparents on a class field trip? Really? People do that?

But him skipping a birthday party b/c he was "pissy" is mean and immature and not okay.

At this age, I attend my nephew's bday parties b/c I actually enjoy watching a bunch of toddlers run around. But I probably won't by the time he is age 6 or so. Because frankly, he'll have better things to do at a party with his friends then hang out with his aunt. But I won't skip a party b/c I'm pissy at his mom (my sister). I'll skip it b/c I don't want to go. But I will take my nephew to a movie or something for his bday.
went on one today and yes there were probably 15 grandparents there that I saw. I will see a ton at field day tomorrow too.

Now for the record I don't want or expect him to go on field trips or attend every 9 week award ceremony or field day etc. I do think it will not hurt him to attend the 2 recitals Hip Hop has a year. My Dad is retired and in very good health. So besides him not wanting to, there is no reason why he can't. Now I would not expect him to attend every game in a season every weekend, but twice a year is not that much.
He did not come to Merida's Girl Scout initiation either and I invited him to that.
The kids think he hung the moon just like I did when I was a kid. Because kids don't see that while he is around he is so fun but then they don't think about all the times he was not around when he should have been. Apparently my mom said he bitched about attending my things when I was a kid too and bitched about having to pay for my extra curriculars when he had plenty of money.

-- Edited by Balloon Animal on Thursday 15th of May 2014 09:00:58 PM

Not wanting to is reason enough not to go.

Cactus · Senior Member

Balloon Animal wrote:
Forty-two wrote:
BA tell them he can't come to everything, they need to accept that you don't want them to grow up spoiled and think everything is about them
They already know considering he has failed to come to many things. But it sends a mixed message regardless because my mom always comes to the important stuff. And they see all the other kids grandparents at all the important stuff.
I am pretty sure I read from a therapist that you can never "spoil" by giving too much love and support. You only spoil by allowing bad behaviors or too many material things. That is like saying don't hug your kids too much, you might spoil them. Showing up to watch your grandchild dance in a recital they have been working hard on for 6 months is not spoiling. Calling to tell them happy birthday on their birthday is not spoiling.

It isn't going to recitals that spoils kids, it's doing things just because they want you to.

Cactus · Senior Member

And I am not saying a parent should never do something just because a kid wants them to, but the idea that someone is doing something wrong in not doing something just because the kid wants them to is incorrect.

Cactus · Senior Member

Balloon Animal wrote:
ana wrote:
Just because a child wants something, doesn't mean they get to dictate an adult's actions.

Did you get that anywhere I said anything about the kids dictating anyone's actions?

You seem to think he is doing something wrong in not doing what they want, that is the issue.

Balloon Animal · Guru

Cactus wrote:
Balloon Animal wrote:
ana wrote:
Just because a child wants something, doesn't mean they get to dictate an adult's actions.

Did you get that anywhere I said anything about the kids dictating anyone's actions?
You seem to think he is doing something wrong in not doing what they want, that is the issue.

I think it is wrong to not be there to support them in their one extra curricular activity when all the other kids have their family members there and their other grandparents come and they ask him nicely. I also think it is wrong to not acknowledge your grandchild's birthday with a call a card or something. He is coming to the party and that is good, but a call that day would not have hurt him either. And showing up to a birthday party completely empty handed is rude. At least bring a card and stick a few bucks in there.

ana · Senior Member

I think it is nice he comes to a child's birthday party. He is showing his love and support that way. You seem to always want more. The kid is not going to remember a card and a few bucks!

As for the recital, perhaps teach your kids that just because someone else has something doesn't mean they are entitled to it too.

It is not wrong to not go to a recital if you don't want to. That's what adults get to do. Decide for themselves.

You, as a parent present, should be enough for your child. Your father isn't the parent BA, you are!

Cactus · Senior Member

BA, I think I would go back to my earlier post. It seems like he does do things with and for the kids, but you focus on what he doesn't do, on what he doesn't give, instead of appreciating him for what he is. Not everybody is going to be a good grandparent in the same exact way. Comparing one's situation to others generally doesn't end well. Kids shouldn't think that just because they see someone else's grandfather doing something their own should be doing it as well. They, and you, should value him as an individual, not just as someone to do the things they think a grandfather should from some preconceived notice or comparison to others.

OpheliaDev1 · Guru

BA, I can feel that you are angry and frustrated with your Dad. Respectfully, I'm wondering if this is maybe more about the relationship with you and him than with him and the kids?

I get that you see grandparents at events and your kids wish their grandpa was there. But that doesn't mean that he should come or that he's a bad grampa for not coming. (Things like spanking your kids and not acknowledging bdays are definitely checks in the "bad grampa" column, though.)

I love my little Nephew to pieces. I keep candy in my car specifically for him, I help plan and execute his bday parties. I would rather CLAW OFF MY FACE than go to a field day or an awards ceremony.

My dearly beloved favorite aunt (childfree) did special things with me. Take me to an art museum, teach me to cook, etc. She would rather claw off her face than attend a kid's bday party, etc.

I get that from your POV, him coming to watch your child is "supporting" that kid's interests. But I know in my case, I value interacting with my nephew, not playing audience.

Your kids may be disappointed, and that's fine. It's okay for them to be sad. But honestly, I think it's an unreasonable expectation to expect an adult to sit through long, interminable and BORING (god, so boring) kid events.

Forty-two · Guru

OD you are spot on and I say this as a mom with three kids. My son is going to have a concert next week I don't want to go be damned if I would expect his aunt and uncle and grandparents to go.

And there is another parenting angle take I have on this. My kid has been a. Athlete for years and when the discussion if going to games came up I gave her a strong discussion about self motivation independence gratification etc. I told her it should not matter one hill of beans if I was there for an event her own values on doing the best she can should pervail it should not matter who is there cheating her on. She needs to have her own personal strength to be the best she can be

Aurora · Senior Member

aberswyth wrote:
Forty-two! Hello!

I admit I don't understand birthday parties for one or two-year-olds.

Nor do I. Then again the idea of giving a one year old sugar (aka a cake) bugs me, so maybe I am weird.

Aurora · Senior Member

Balloon Animal wrote:
Cactus wrote:
Balloon Animal wrote:
ana wrote:
Just because a child wants something, doesn't mean they get to dictate an adult's actions.

Did you get that anywhere I said anything about the kids dictating anyone's actions?
You seem to think he is doing something wrong in not doing what they want, that is the issue.
I think it is wrong to not be there to support them in their one extra curricular activity when all the other kids have their family members there and their other grandparents come and they ask him nicely. I also think it is wrong to not acknowledge your grandchild's birthday with a call a card or something. He is coming to the party and that is good, but a call that day would not have hurt him either. And showing up to a birthday party completely empty handed is rude. At least bring a card and stick a few bucks in there.

You are assuming he will come with no gift. But honestly, if I was going to a birthday party, I would not call on (or send a gift for) the person's b-day. Obviously I'd say happy birthday and give a gift at the party.

OpheliaDev1 · Guru

I kind of don't get this idea that kids (or people, really) need "support" in their hobbies, etc. Once on Zetaboards, a poster insisted that a good friend would attend an friend's dance or music recital, b/c that was important to that friend. I just can't see expecting a friend to sit through 2+ hrs so they can watch you perform for 10 minutes. To me, "support" is something we offer during struggles. You support a friend with cancer or going through a divorce or losing their job. You don't need to "support" your friend's love of the tuba or square dancing.

Forty-two · Guru

OD that was the point I was trying to make and I want to teach my kids they don't need outside support to do well they need to find it within themselves. Support to me is paying for and giving transportation to these events nothing more.

winds55 · Guru

Balloon Animal wrote:
Cactus wrote:
Balloon Animal wrote:
ana wrote:
Just because a child wants something, doesn't mean they get to dictate an adult's actions.

Did you get that anywhere I said anything about the kids dictating anyone's actions?
You seem to think he is doing something wrong in not doing what they want, that is the issue.
I think it is wrong to not be there to support them in their one extra curricular activity when all the other kids have their family members there and their other grandparents come and they ask him nicely. I also think it is wrong to not acknowledge your grandchild's birthday with a call a card or something. He is coming to the party and that is good, but a call that day would not have hurt him either. And showing up to a birthday party completely empty handed is rude. At least bring a card and stick a few bucks in there.

First of all, just because someone asks nicely doesn't mean the answer is yes.

Second, it doesn't matter what other kids have, or what other grandparents do. What are you going to do when all the other kids get cars when they're 16, get to stay out until 2 AM, go to Florida every spring break, or anything you disapprove of? You can't really tell your kids "If all your friends jump off a bridge, would you?" because that's exactly what you're teaching them.

Third, just because you think something is wrong doesn't make it so. Your father has a life. It doesn't revolve around you or your kids. That's how it should be.

OpheliaDev1 · Guru

Aurora wrote:
aberswyth wrote:
Forty-two! Hello!

I admit I don't understand birthday parties for one or two-year-olds.
Nor do I. Then again the idea of giving a one year old sugar (aka a cake) bugs me, so maybe I am weird.

In my experience, they are fun. It was basically like a picnic with some balloons and cake.

I think birthday parties can be valuable b/c it teaches kids about being gracious guests and hosts. And it teaches kids about graciously giving and recieving. It's a chance to for kids to learn how to both be in the spotlight for a bit, and also to let others "have their moment".

ana · Senior Member

But at one or two years old, that is not a lesson they are ready to learn.

OpheliaDev1 · Guru

At 1 or 2, it's pretty much for the parents. In my case, it was low-key and fun. My sister reserved a covered area at local park, we played with the babies and ate some hotdogs and cake.

In this case, my nephew had 2 older brothers (my sister's stepsons), so while it wasn't necessarily a learning experience for her son at age 1 or 2, it WAS a learning experience for them.

kinalikamom · Senior Member

Forty-two wrote:
OD you are spot on and I say this as a mom with three kids. My son is going to have a concert next week I don't want to go be damned if I would expect his aunt and uncle and grandparents to go.

And there is another parenting angle take I have on this. My kid has been a. Athlete for years and when the discussion if going to games came up I gave her a strong discussion about self motivation independence gratification etc. I told her it should not matter one hill of beans if I was there for an event her own values on doing the best she can should pervail it should not matter who is there cheating her on. She needs to have her own personal strength to be the best she can be

I must say I love your autocorrect, 42!

Balloon Animal · Guru

winds55 wrote:
Balloon Animal wrote:
Cactus wrote:
Balloon Animal wrote:
ana wrote:
Just because a child wants something, doesn't mean they get to dictate an adult's actions.

Did you get that anywhere I said anything about the kids dictating anyone's actions?
You seem to think he is doing something wrong in not doing what they want, that is the issue.
I think it is wrong to not be there to support them in their one extra curricular activity when all the other kids have their family members there and their other grandparents come and they ask him nicely. I also think it is wrong to not acknowledge your grandchild's birthday with a call a card or something. He is coming to the party and that is good, but a call that day would not have hurt him either. And showing up to a birthday party completely empty handed is rude. At least bring a card and stick a few bucks in there.
First of all, just because someone asks nicely doesn't mean the answer is yes.
Second, it doesn't matter what other kids have, or what other grandparents do. What are you going to do when all the other kids get cars when they're 16, get to stay out until 2 AM, go to Florida every spring break, or anything you disapprove of? You can't really tell your kids "If all your friends jump off a bridge, would you?" because that's exactly what you're teaching them.
Third, just because you think something is wrong doesn't make it so. Your father has a life. It doesn't revolve around you or your kids. That's how it should b

Well our lives don't revolve around him either but he gets super pissy when we don't drop everything to do what he wants. He has told us to drop plans we already have because he wants to visit and I am not that kind of person who breaks plans.

ana · Senior Member

I can see you are really a tit-for-tat family.

OpheliaDev1 · Guru

BA, I think your dad has set up an unhealthy dynamic, and you are trying to hold him to his own "rules". The problem is a) they are unhealthy rules and b) your dad's actual "rules" are "I do what I want" not "family drops everything to accomodate family" or whatever.

So I think you'll do better to step back, decide what your own rules and boundaries are, then hold yourself to them. You can't make your dad follow your rules, but you can choose to interact with him (or not) based on your rules and boundaries.

Cactus · Senior Member

BA, I don't think anyone would blame you for setting boundaries and saying "no" to your Dad. Instead it seems like you are doing things you don't want to, resenting him for it and trying to keep things "even" in your expectations of him. As Ophelia said, an unhealthy dynamic.

kinalikamom · Senior Member

OpheliaDev1 wrote:
BA, I think your dad has set up an unhealthy dynamic, and you are trying to hold him to his own "rules". The problem is a) they are unhealthy rules and b) your dad's actual "rules" are "I do what I want" not "family drops everything to accomodate family" or whatever.

So I think you'll do better to step back, decide what your own rules and boundaries are, then hold yourself to them. You can't make your dad follow your rules, but you can choose to interact with him (or not) based on your rules and boundaries.

This. All of it.

Balloon Animal · Guru

OpheliaDev1 wrote:
BA, I think your dad has set up an unhealthy dynamic, and you are trying to hold him to his own "rules". The problem is a) they are unhealthy rules and b) your dad's actual "rules" are "I do what I want" not "family drops everything to accomodate family" or whatever.

So I think you'll do better to step back, decide what your own rules and boundaries are, then hold yourself to them. You can't make your dad follow your rules, but you can choose to interact with him (or not) based on your rules and boundaries.

thank you and you are right 100%. That is kinda what I learned a couple years ago and what I try to do. As the title says this was my rant. I have started doing this with him just upholding my morals and boundaries and while it is not always easy, it has to be done. I tried for too long to just do whatever he wanted even if it was not right because I did not want to stand up to him. I can't stop from feeling sad about it though. Having a relationship with a person that has some toxic personality traits is hard and you just have to try to work around it and concentrate on their good parts and there are good parts. Its a balancing act.

Balloon Animal · Guru

Cactus wrote:
BA, I don't think anyone would blame you for setting boundaries and saying "no" to your Dad. Instead it seems like you are doing things you don't want to, resenting him for it and trying to keep things "even" in your expectations of him. As Ophelia said, an unhealthy dynamic.

Thank you and very good advice.

winds55 · Guru

morals? seriously? going or not going to a birthday party is matter of morals?

I'm not sure your father is the toxic one.

flan327 · Senior Member

I have ONE granddaughter. She turned 2 in April.

Of course, I will be there for her B-day parties, for Christmas, Easter, Mother's Day.

Why wouldn't I be? She brings joy to my heart.

flan

ana · Senior Member

But you can't speak for every grandparent flan.

Plus, I think grandpa is coming to the party, he just didn't call or drop off a present on the actual bday.

You do know that presents/money are not love, right BA?

flan327 · Senior Member

ana wrote:
But you can't speak for every grandparent flan.

Plus, I think grandpa is coming to the party, he just didn't call or drop off a present on the actual bday.

You do know that presents/money are not love, right BA?

But I CAN feel sorry for a grandparent who doesn't want a relationship with his or her grandkids.

flan

ana · Senior Member

It's not like he doesn't want a relationship with them. He is just not doing everything that BA wants and expects.

Grandparents are people that are allowed to have their own lives and make choices for themselves.

And why feel sorry for someone who makes a different choice that you?

Do you feel sorry for people that chose NOT to have children too?

Balloon Animal · Guru

winds55 wrote:
morals? seriously? going or not going to a birthday party is matter of morals?

I'm not sure your father is the toxic one.

morals like that he thought it was okay for me to cancel on a party we rsvped too so we could do something with him. That is not very moral.

Balloon Animal · Guru

ana wrote:
But you can't speak for every grandparent flan.

Plus, I think grandpa is coming to the party, he just didn't call or drop off a present on the actual bday.

You do know that presents/money are not love, right BA?

yes. Like I said in the original post, he did not even call. A phone call is free. A birthday card is under $5. That is not breaking anyone's bank.

Balloon Animal · Guru

ana wrote:
It's not like he doesn't want a relationship with them. He is just not doing everything that BA wants and expects.

Grandparents are people that are allowed to have their own lives and make choices for themselves.

And why feel sorry for someone who makes a different choice that you?

Do you feel sorry for people that chose NOT to have children too?

huh? how did this become about people having children? If you don't want children, don't have them. Works for me.

ana · Senior Member

Because it was your father's choice to be a grandfather. He gives what he wants and that should be enough.

Flan said she felt sorry for him. Why feel sorry for someone who made a choice right for them?

Forty-two · Guru

flan327 wrote:
ana wrote:
But you can't speak for every grandparent flan.

Plus, I think grandpa is coming to the party, he just didn't call or drop off a present on the actual bday.

You do know that presents/money are not love, right BA?
But I CAN feel sorry for a grandparent who doesn't want a relationship with his or her grandkids.
flan

That doesn't make sense to me. I am guessing you would want to be a grandparent to your grand children so you are feeling sorry for someone who doesn't want what you want. It makes me wonder if people fell sorry for me because I don't want to have 10 kids

Aardvark · But my mom says I'm cool!

ana wrote:
Just because a child wants something, doesn't mean they get to dictate an adult's actions.

This should be required reading for kids every day.

flan327 · Senior Member

Forty-two wrote:
flan327 wrote:
ana wrote:
But you can't speak for every grandparent flan.

Plus, I think grandpa is coming to the party, he just didn't call or drop off a present on the actual bday.

You do know that presents/money are not love, right BA?
But I CAN feel sorry for a grandparent who doesn't want a relationship with his or her grandkids.
flan
That doesn't make sense to me. I am guessing you would want to be a grandparent to your grand children so you are feeling sorry for someone who doesn't want what you want. It makes me wonder if people fell sorry for me because I don't want to have 10 kids

I certainly don't.

I don't know the dynamics of BA's relationship with her father. That's not my point.

I raised 2 kids; I love them dearly and they love me. Why wouldn't I want a relationship with the child of my child?

flan

Balloon Animal · Guru

I can understand what Flan is saying as far as I cannot imagine not being there to attend my future grandchild's dance recital or elementary graduation or girl scout initiation. I already told DH that if our kids move far away for work or whatever, I want to move and go live near them so I can actually have a good relationship with my grandchildren because seeing them twice a year is not going to cut it for me. I would want to be there for their lives and their important events.
Both of my parents moved away when they knew I was going to have kids and now they bitch when they have to drive to come see us or when they miss something. Well duh I say to that. You are the ones who moved away when you knew I was going to have kids.

ana · Senior Member

What happens if your children all move to different citites BA? Or they move out of the country?

It's great you want to be near them but it's not always feasible

My parents moved back from California because my sister was pregnant and expecting their first grandchild but it did set them back financially. So, in your mind, because they couldn't do much financially, they didn't love their grandchildren? My mom watched both of them until they started school, saving my sister thousands and thousands of dollars. My parents did what they could. They don't drive and didn't make it to any games etc. But, they have never missed a birthday.

-- Edited by ana on Saturday 17th of May 2014 08:44:26 AM

SwissMiss · Veteran Member

BA maybe look at it this way..... You said earlier your kids think he hung moon. So he's doing something right, no?

They don't seem to hold the same resentment that you do, and I am sure the last thing you want is to upset them in a relationship they are otherwise happy with. Kids pick up on their parent's dynamics. If the youngest is 7, they are old enough to start defining their own relationship with their grandfather. It really isn't up to you to define unless he is harming them somehow.

I am sure it's hard for a mom to take a step back. But the last thing you want is for your expectations of your relationship with your dad to colour what the kids expect out of a grandfather. If it's otherwise happy (he hung the moon!), maybe you need to take a cue from the kids as to when you NEED to intercede vs when you WANT to because you're the offended party. If the kids aren't offended, I suggest letting it go and not trying to control their relationship.

I have less than interested grandparents so I get it on a fundamental level. It's hard and it sucks when expectations are not met. But they aren't your expectations to meet, they are the kids'.

winds55 · Guru

Balloon Animal wrote:
winds55 wrote:
morals? seriously? going or not going to a birthday party is matter of morals?

I'm not sure your father is the toxic one.
morals like that he thought it was okay for me to cancel on a party we rsvped too so we could do something with him. That is not very moral.

That's an etiquette issue. If you think it's a moral issue you need to get a grip on reality.

Balloon Animal · Guru

ana wrote:
What happens if your children all move to different citites BA? Or they move out of the country?

It's great you want to be near them but it's not always feasible

My parents moved back from California because my sister was pregnant and expecting their first grandchild but it did set them back financially. So, in your mind, because they couldn't do much financially, they didn't love their grandchildren? My mom watched both of them until they started school, saving my sister thousands and thousands of dollars. My parents did what they could. They don't drive and didn't make it to any games etc. But, they have never missed a birthday.

-- Edited by ana on Saturday 17th of May 2014 08:44:26 AM

Watching their grandchildren every day I think is more than enough! I can't even trust my Dad to watch them for 2 hours in our house without him doing something inappropriate. SMH.

Obviously that may happen with them moving all over or for some reason us not being able to move where they are, but I am going to do the best I can, let's put it that way. I won't voluntarily move away like my mother and father did.

Balloon Animal · Guru

winds55 wrote:
Balloon Animal wrote:
winds55 wrote:
morals? seriously? going or not going to a birthday party is matter of morals?

I'm not sure your father is the toxic one.
morals like that he thought it was okay for me to cancel on a party we rsvped too so we could do something with him. That is not very moral.
That's an etiquette issue. If you think it's a moral issue you need to get a grip on reality.

No to me it is morals. For one it becomes lying. If I say "We will be there" then we are there barring an extreme emergency. That is the people I want to raise my kids to be. Reliable. Trustworthy. Dependable. People that flake out and cancel are usually low character people in my experience.

Balloon Animal · Guru

SwissMiss wrote:
BA maybe look at it this way..... You said earlier your kids think he hung moon. So he's doing something right, no?

They don't seem to hold the same resentment that you do, and I am sure the last thing you want is to upset them in a relationship they are otherwise happy with. Kids pick up on their parent's dynamics. If the youngest is 7, they are old enough to start defining their own relationship with their grandfather. It really isn't up to you to define unless he is harming them somehow.

I am sure it's hard for a mom to take a step back. But the last thing you want is for your expectations of your relationship with your dad to colour what the kids expect out of a grandfather. If it's otherwise happy (he hung the moon!), maybe you need to take a cue from the kids as to when you NEED to intercede vs when you WANT to because you're the offended party. If the kids aren't offended, I suggest letting it go and not trying to control their relationship.

I have less than interested grandparents so I get it on a fundamental level. It's hard and it sucks when expectations are not met. But they aren't your expectations to meet, they are the kids'.

Hip hop was sad about him not coming to the recital. Last time and this time. Not enough to be devastated but it did disappoint him. So they do at least notice some of this. Robot was very upset by the spanking incident. Unlike my mother, I won't cover for him for the kids. She always covered for my Dad when I was growing up. I refuse to do that. If he does something, I am being frank about it. I am not covering for him.

SwissMiss · Veteran Member

I obviously don't know your dad, so I get there is background there that we don't understand. There is a time to intercede (spanking against your direction) and a time to let go (recitals). It just seems like you are putting your disappointment in your relationship with him, onto your kids' relationship with him. Sure, it would be nice if he went to recitals. But you know from your own childhood that's not his thing. So why put the expectation there to begin with?

Who was it that said "The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, and expecting a different result".

Recitals and gifts aren't his thing. They are your thing and there's nothing wrong with that. If he hasn't done it in the 30+ years you've known him, your aren't going to get what you're wanting out of it, he isn't wired that way. No one is suggesting covering for him, but maybe try not to set up the expectation he will be at a recital to begin with. Maybe "Grandpa doesn't do recitals, I'll tape it and how about we invite him over Saturday and you can can make ice cream sundays and show him your routine". Would he open to that? It doesn't sound like he has an issue spending time with them, just actually showing up to events. Unless I'm reading it wrong.

Balloon Animal · Guru

Actually we did the showing the video of the recital to him at home and he barely paid attention to it.

Forty-two · Guru

Balloon Animal wrote:
Actually we did the showing the video of the recital to him at home and he barely paid attention to it.

My God BA I think you need to accept the fact the he just isn't interested and move on. What is interesting and important to you is not necessesarily interesting and important to someone else. We all parent differently but I think you are teaching your kids the wrong message if you make a big deal out of their grandfather being there. My kids grandmother came to their recitals but I hope I raised them not to give a **** if she did or not. Your kids are going to be filled with a world of disappointment if you teach them what BA wants and does is the only right thing and the important thing.

ana · Senior Member

I love my nieces and nephews but I only went to a couple of shows/recitals. I wanted to poke my eye out with a fork. Never again!

I would not be pleased if I missed the show (on purpose) and then was held captive to a "showing".

I had friends that did that to us once at a dinner out. 700 pictures! I did not care. And I hated that the entire dinner was around their trip. Every time the conversation moved on, they brought it right back to their trip. We all traveled but no-one else bored the entire group with hundreds of pictures! I passed them without even looking at after the first 50. We get the idea.

Kids shows/recitals are awful. I know a lot of parents that hate them too!